Public Commander Keen Forum

Was this level that made you hate Shockshunds? For me, yes. I'm playing on Normal with an eye to play Hard next time, god help me if there's a third one!

I played the game on easy mode first, so my first encounter with the Shockshunds was the horde of them in the last level, the only time they showed up in easy. They weren't very hard to take down, especially since you're given tons of ammo, so my initial reaction to them was amusement. In harder difficulties, though, they're all over the place, and they're easily one the cheapest enemies in the game. And yes, they're awful in Neutrino Burst Injector. There aren't a lot in Regulation Control Center on hard, but they're so strategically-placed that they're hard to deal with there, too.

For a while my preferred way to play Keen was to try to get as far as I could in Hard mode without saving at all. Keen 5 was one of my favorites for that. I didn't always get as far as this level (trying to go in "level order"), but when I did, it ended my game just about every time. The Shockshunds definitely were largely responsible for that. Maybe if I had thoroughly practiced the level on it's own (instead of just playing it "whenever I got that far", which wasn't a high percentage of attempts) I'd've been able to get through it, who knows.

What is a neutrino burst injector anyway?

What is a neutrino burst injector anyway?

It directs the flow of neutrinos for the purpose of causing a neutrino burst, which if I understand correctly is a supernova event. I'm not sure how this works in conjunction with the Brownian Motion Inducer and ultimately the Quantum Exploration Dynami. Regulation Control and Energy Flow Systems seem self explanatory in relation to things.

Neutrino Burst Injector as a level was always a weird one for me. That bouncy Slicestar was far more intimidating to me than the Shockshund.

Ceilick wrote: ↑Sun May 16, 2021 20:42 Neutrino Burst Injector as a level was always a weird one for me.

Me too. It's the backgrounds, I think. Also, it's the only level on easy difficulty to have a bouncing Slicestar, which is quite a wakeup call. Brings back memories of the giant Jacks in Keen3 and how dangerous and unpredictable they were.

I'd agree that this is the weirdest of the elevator machine levels. The two red ones always seemed to be the "cool" ones, and I'd always leave these green ones to last — usually this one to avoid that slicestar. And having only one fuse in the machine is a bit of a letdown after all the trouble getting there.

For me, it's that Neutrino Burst Injector has that big open area: more than any of the other elevator machines. My main memory is of all the Shikadi, particularly on those slopes. It's also one of the few times you get to interact with Shikadi without poles (particularly on Easy).

But the slicestars (both the one at the beginning which gets everyone the first time they play and the bouncing one) are also pretty memorable.

Neutrino Burst Injector as a level was always a weird one for me. That bouncy Slicestar was far more intimidating to me than the Shockshund.

No way! The Slicestar is based on physics, so it's predictable to an extent. You're also unlikely to get bad luck with them multiple times in a row (as in, if you play without saving and make it to the end in consecutive attempts, it won't bounce into you every time). The Shockshunds, both the one at the start and the one on the slope move unpredictably and fast, and any time you are at a lower plane than them (both times in this level), you're at a huge disadvantage.

If you have any tip about the Shockshund, i.e. if I'm "doing it wrong", please let me know!

I played the game on easy mode first, so my first encounter with the Shockshunds was the horde of them in the last level, the only time they showed up in easy. They weren't very hard to take down, especially since you're given tons of ammo, so my initial reaction to them was amusement. In harder difficulties, though, they're all over the place, and they're easily one the cheapest enemies in the game. And yes, they're awful in Neutrino Burst Injector. There aren't a lot in Regulation Control Center on hard, but they're so strategically-placed that they're hard to deal with there, too.

Funnily enough, I think the "right" way to do the Quantum Explosion Dynamo is to go the other way, so you come out underneath the Shockshunds and simply shoot up at them. I did manage to brute force it one time in Normal mode going to them horizontally, but probably died about 20-30 times.

What does "cheapest enemies" mean, btw?

Yeah, I can't imagine they're fun in the RCC either. I'll be playing Hard in a moment here.

For a while my preferred way to play Keen was to try to get as far as I could in Hard mode without saving at all. Keen 5 was one of my favorites for that.

I'm doing that with Normal, I'm going to try it with Hard. Obviously depends how much harder it is! I remember Keen 6 being beastly on Hard.
I think the only levels I saved on were the Gravitational Damping Hub and the Quantum Explosion Dynamo at the end. Damned if the Neutrino level didn't test my patience, though! Must have died 50 times with the Shockshunds.

When I say an enemy is "cheap" what I mean is that they get in cheap shots on you very easily. Think of the Vorticon Elites, and how easy it was to get sniped by one. Shockshunds are just that. True, they have one less hit point, and their projectiles can be stopped by your weapon easier than the Vorticon Elite's, but the level design in Keen5 is more advanced to accommodate the Shockshund's weaknesses.

spikey wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 13:20 Funnily enough, I think the "right" way to do the Quantum Explosion Dynamo is to go the other way, so you come out underneath the Shockshunds and simply shoot up at them. I did manage to brute force it one time in Normal mode going to them horizontally, but probably died about 20-30 times.

That is how I beat them the first time. If you so much as take a glance into that room at the start of the level, they all bunch up beneath you and it's borderline impossible to drop down below them. The large amount of ammo in the corridor that leads up to them if you take the long way around was essentially the developer's way of letting you know what route you're supposed to take.

spikey wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 13:20 I remember Keen 6 being beastly on Hard.

Yep. On top of the already-weird level design that wasn't anything like the previous two games, you also seem to consistently get swamped by beefy enemies like Blooguards that soak up tons of ammo, in addition to an overreliance on invincible enemies like Giks. The Orbatrix and Fleex also get pretty overused in the few levels they show up in, too. I found BASA in particular to be a really annoying level, and I'm glad you can skip it.

Shockshunds are bastards and nowhere moreso than in the Neutrino Burst Injector. They're used almost too well here, taking full advantage of their ability to jump down on top of you with little warning pretty much everywhere they appear.

For whatever reason though the part of this level that really stressed me out back in the day was the bouncing slicestar. I guess I hate them everywhere they show up but I find them surprisingly hard to avoid in spite of their semi-predictable movement. The worst is when I would cower from it on this map in that pit behind where the Shikadi is, and its trajectory would suddenly take it right down in there and kill me when it had harmlessly bounced away every other time. I've gotten better at avoiding them but I still hate the damn things.

Yep. On top of the already-weird level design that wasn't anything like the previous two games, you also seem to consistently get swamped by beefy enemies like Blooguards that soak up tons of ammo, in addition to an overreliance on invincible enemies like Giks. The Orbatrix and Fleex also get pretty overused in the few levels they show up in, too. I found BASA in particular to be a really annoying level, and I'm glad you can skip it.

I love Keen 6 to death but omg yes there are so many Giks on Hard. To this day I really, really want to believe I can kill the sh*t out of them by jumping and shooting their bellies while they slide underneath, but sadly in spite of how bad I want it it hasn't become any more true.

I played through this level a while ago in Normal. I didn't really find the Shockshunds to be too bad here, although I only dealt with the second one (on the thin platform that changes angle throughout) once so I might've been lucky. For the first one I just waited for it to come down and then fired a double. Upon encountering the second one, where it was above me, I did a pogo jump away from it. Once I was in level with it, I shot back at it twice. Opening the level in Abiathar, it seems there are at least two more in Hard. That bouncing Slicestar at the end was a bit intimidating at first, but once I figured out its pattern it wasn't too bad. It's nowhere near as bad as getting the stuffed toy VortiNinjas from that dreaded jack and escaping in one piece!

It's quite an interesting level with a few unique parts: open design at the upper part; unique, shiny background; long, skinny platform with a slope that actually changes angle throughout. (The only other part like this in Keen, as far as I can remember, is the bump in the center of Ion Ventilation System, which has a bunch of Shikadi Candy above. I think Keen 6 had at least one dynamic slope, but I can't remember.) It took me several attempts to get all of the Vitalin below the left end of the skinny platform. The first Slicestar challenge is pretty memorable and interesting, especially when there's a Shelley around to keep you on your toes.