Commander Keen Meets the Meats

Here, you can get help with anything or just chat about the original Commander Keen games.
Ceilick
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Post by Ceilick »

It ends:
"Uh, Mom, what are we having for supper tonight?" Billy asked

"Oh, we're having liver, dear."

"I HATE liver! I don't have to eat liver. I saved the earth!"

THE END

(Possibly continued in... "Commander Keen Meets the Meats")

Commander Keen will definately return in....

"Goodbye, Galaxy!"

Watch for it!
Off topic: What if the end of this was the last we had ever heard of Commander Keen? What if "Stay tuned for Goodbye Galaxy" turned out the way "Stay tuned for the Universe is Toast" did? I seriously wonder if this community would even exist.

Grimson: if this does become a mod, I highly suggest the story be built solely off Keen Dreams and exclude any mentioning of Keen 4. The best approach, in my opinion, is to essentially do a "keen dreams 2" in which some meat equivalent of Boobus Tuber (perhaps from a rival meat kingdom like "Beefburgia" or something punny) uses the undestroyed dream machine, like you mentioned, for their own evil ends (or the same purpose of enslaving children like vegetables did).

In any case, if some sort of mod project gets picked up for this, I'll gladly contribute graphically.
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Grimson
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Post by Grimson »

And I'll contribute idea-wise ;)

What engine would this mod be best built on? Dreams would make most sense, but then again, you can't have things like music (although that's not even necessary and I highly doubt it would happen), and Keen's ability to look up & down.

Also, if Dreams engine is used, should Keen stick to Flower Power, or maybe visiting "Beefburgia" granted him a new ability? Since all the enemies are different sorts of meats, I had an idea of a meat-erasing power/weapon, that only leaves a bunch of bones of the enemies (X-mas mod shows that the enemies can be stunned/killed permanently). Or it could be something less orthodox, like a power that makes all enemies turn into stone.
"All those thousands upon thousands of junk foods made for me on the various planets I explored make me wonder how I'm still alive."
Ceilick
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Post by Ceilick »

afaik, music can be patched into Keen dreams. Also, if it is a "keen dreams 2", it should definatley retain the stun ability from keen dreams, even if its visually something different (flower power could either have a different affect on meat or be replaced by something relatively similar).

One idea might be that Keen uses some kind of flame pellets that char the meat enemies, turning them into a temporary stationary fire hazard.

Edit: Found the Tom Hall quote I was thinking about.
http://cc314.shikadi.net/index2.html
Q: Was there any thought of doing a Keen Dreams II? (I've heard there might have been a "Keen meets the meat". If so, would Softdisk have distributed?

A: Nope. I actually disagreed with doing a Keen for Softdisk, knowing that they would keep the rights. I didn't want to leave Keen behind.
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Grimson
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Post by Grimson »

One idea might be that Keen uses some kind of flame pellets that char the meat enemies, turning them into a temporary stationary fire hazard.
It's an interesting idea, however if stunned enemies were hazards, the levels might become too difficult, there would have to be less enemies or levels would otherwise have to be designed differently (for example narrow corridors with enemies would be impossible to pass).

On the contrary, the enemies could "stun" into opaque blocks of ice. After all, meats are stored in fridges and freezers ;) Keen's new ability/power/weapon could be called Freeze Breeze (similar to Flower Power).
"All those thousands upon thousands of junk foods made for me on the various planets I explored make me wonder how I'm still alive."
Ceilick
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Post by Ceilick »

however if stunned enemies were hazards, the levels might become too difficult, there would have to be less enemies or levels would otherwise have to be designed differently (for example narrow corridors with enemies would be impossible to pass).
I don't think nearly as difficult as one might imagine: if this were implemented in the original keen dreams, only the level Rhubarb Rapids would become difficult or impossible. Keen dreams level design is much more open, I think, than any other keen episode.

Also, turning enemies into temporary hazards adds some strategy to where players try to stun their foes.

That said, I agree it might end up being just too difficult and your Freeze Breeze idea is a great alternative.
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VikingBoyBilly
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Post by VikingBoyBilly »

Killed by a stunned enemy...
Billy: "Gee, thanks alot for standing RIGHT IN THE DOOR when I zapped you >: "
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Levellass
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Post by Levellass »

Off topic: What if the end of this was the last we had ever heard of Commander Keen? What if "Stay tuned for Goodbye Galaxy" turned out the way "Stay tuned for the Universe is Toast" did? I seriously wonder if this community would even exist.
Deep in the net, half buried by popups and spam emails, there is a site. A small and simple site with a few broken, crumbling links. It has maybe a few hundred visitors to its name, and hasn't been updated in years. Eventually it will die, alone and unloved.

This is the Jill of the Jungle modding community. It had a peak of three people. There, but for the grace of Tom, go us.

What engine would this mod be best built on? Dreams would make most sense, but then again, you can't have things like music (although that's not even necessary and I highly doubt it would happen), and Keen's ability to look up & down.
I've been trying to revive the music capacity in K.D I think it may be possible.

Also, if Dreams engine is used, should Keen stick to Flower Power, or maybe visiting "Beefburgia" granted him a new ability? Since all the enemies are different sorts of meats, I had an idea of a meat-erasing power/weapon, that only leaves a bunch of bones of the enemies (X-mas mod shows that the enemies can be stunned/killed permanently). Or it could be something less orthodox, like a power that makes all enemies turn into stone.
It's simple enough, the main thing is ALL enemies become the same thing when 'stunned' which can do anything from vanish, to recover to behave like a totally different enemy. (We were going to have 'killed' enemies recover on hard mode, but decided to scrap this.)
What you really need, not what you think you ought to want.
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Grimson
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Post by Grimson »

I've been trying to revive the music capacity in K.D I think it may be possible.
What about Keen's ability to grab into edges in K4-6? Would that be possible to transfer as well?
Also, turning enemies into temporary hazards adds some strategy to where players try to stun their foes.
I used to play the Keen games (except Dreams) avoiding stunning whenever possible. It was much harder, but possible (for example in Keen 3, I used to avoid killing the vorticons because we learn in K2 that they aren't actually evil :o)
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Levellass
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Post by Levellass »

What about Keen's ability to grab into edges in K4-6? Would that be possible to transfer as well?


No, that relies on Keen-tile interaction which is quite complex. A sufficiently talented patcher could do it, but I am not them. :p
What you really need, not what you think you ought to want.
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Nospike
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Post by Nospike »

Levellass, I thought you and lemm were the two patching gods.
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Post by Genius314 »

Nospike wrote:Levellass, I thought you and lemm were the two patching gods.
Lemm is the patching god. Levellass is more like the patching Buddha.

8)
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Post by LJH »

Nospike wrote:First living veggies, now living meat. I don't know what to say.
Because there's SO no such thing as living meat... think about it.
time goes by 時の流れは二人を変えて行くけれど
失くしたものも夢見るものもその手を取って思い出すよ
いつも君の側で...
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VikingBoyBilly
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Post by VikingBoyBilly »

LJH wrote:
Nospike wrote:First living veggies, now living meat. I don't know what to say.
Because there's SO no such thing as living meat... think about it.
Or living vegetables, for that matter. (think about it)
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Grimson
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Post by Grimson »

Lol...
"All those thousands upon thousands of junk foods made for me on the various planets I explored make me wonder how I'm still alive."
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RoboBlue
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Post by RoboBlue »

No such thing as living french fries at least. :P
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