The Keys of Krodacia: Revision Discussion

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Snortimer
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Post by Snortimer » Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:34

My hope is that the songs will be made less dissonant and aimless.

If there is dissonance, it should lead to and resolve somewhere, not just aimlessly wallow around. Discernable beats, question/answer, the works.

More attention paid to harmony and resolving intervals.
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Eros
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Post by Eros » Tue Mar 01, 2011 20:21

not exactly a revision, but can we have a soundtrack release of updated music?
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Re: The Keys of Krodacia: Revision Discussion

Post by Scilicet » Wed Mar 02, 2011 17:30

I think I said this before, but I like the design of the slurple. They're kind of cute. They do, however, jump really high for globs of slime. Maybe they could be made to jump at a slightly lower height. In connection with slurples, I think maybe the Slime Temple could be relabeled "Slurple City." This would be fitting, especially on the hard difficulty.
Would it be possible to redesign the look of the hopper? Its current look is boring. Maybe you could give it legs or a giant spring, like on the Zoombinis. Also, the rate of the hopper's jumps seems to speed up and slow down. Am I imagining that, or is it something put in to make the game more difficult?
Side note: I went back to playing Keen 4 after playing TKoK, and for a while, I could not figure out why I was dying on The Perilous Pit. The mad mushroom jumps higher every third jump, while the hopper jumps higher every other jump, so I walked right into the mad mushroom because I was used to the hopper's behavior. Boy, did I feel silly when I figured that out.

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Post by Deltamatic » Wed Mar 02, 2011 17:56

Slime Temple sounds more interesting than Slurple City, imo.

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Post by Eros » Wed Mar 02, 2011 21:14

slimageddon?
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kuliwil wrote:I wish that oa;fdjgnae;ogubneaogiearh;igbnerfgoajfsgoefnh
Granted. You have just had a severe stroke.

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Post by RivaStyle » Sat Apr 30, 2011 19:44

What about "Slurple Shrine"?

PS: wow, back into PCKF after a bit of stop...
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Post by The Keen Commander » Wed May 18, 2011 19:29

I realize this is a big bump...but I'm just curious if this project is still going to continue and if there has been any progress so far in making it happen...I'm really excited to see an update to this game, something that I feel it really could use. Is there anything going on with this project Ceilick?
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Post by Ceilick » Wed May 18, 2011 19:49

It's not something I'm actively working on.

One thing I have determined while working on what I have done so far, however, is that despite what I said earlier about 'keeping true to the original' and stuff I'm really not going to be happy with the mod unless I'm free to do whatever I want. So basically, when I do get to working on it more, I'm doing things my way regardless of how it may differ from the original.

Depending on how things go, the original tkok may be only be like a beta or demo version in comparison (and the original will still be availible, of course, if this revision is ever completed).

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Post by Dynamo » Wed May 18, 2011 20:03

Of course. The more the merrier!
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Post by Eros » Sun May 22, 2011 13:44

small thing really, but can some of the couches be platforms or blocks? it just seems weird for keen to be able to pass through furniture.
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kuliwil wrote:I wish that oa;fdjgnae;ogubneaogiearh;igbnerfgoajfsgoefnh
Granted. You have just had a severe stroke.

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Post by GARGapplesauce » Sun May 22, 2011 22:58

Eros wrote:small thing really, but can some of the couches be platforms or blocks? it just seems weird for keen to be able to pass through furniture.
He's not walking through it, but in front of it. Remember, the game is designed in a "2.5-D" perspective. He's in the foreground, whereas the furniature is not. Kind of like the slug statue in keen 4.
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Post by Syllypryde » Mon May 23, 2011 19:27

Ceilick wrote:......One thing I have determined while working on what I have done so far, however, is that despite what I said earlier about 'keeping true to the original' and stuff I'm really not going to be happy with the mod unless I'm free to do whatever I want. So basically, when I do get to working on it more, I'm doing things my way regardless of how it may differ from the original.

Depending on how things go, the original tkok may be only be like a beta or demo version in comparison......
Syllypryde wrote:Since you guys seem intent on changing everything you might as well change the name of the game, too. Let's call it:

Commander Keen: Episode Worthless: Obviously The Keys of Krodacia is a Piece of Crap so Ceilick Has Decided to Create a Whole New Keen 4 Mod!......

......By the time you guys get done with it, TKOK will be almost unrecognizable!......

......But I am vehmently, and I mean VEHMENTLY opposed to having the level design revised in ANY way. Adding or subtracting a secret area or two, adding or subtracting points or items, or adding a few graphics to the in-level background to improve the scenary is fine. But altering the level design, changing how the level is solved, or eliminating rooms from a level etc, is a big NO NO!!! I will not be pleased if you do this!......

.....In the overall scheme of things it is his mod and he can do whatever he chooses with it. Besides, if I decide I do not like the new revision, I can always continue playing the old one can't I?

Patrick
Syllypryde wrote:..................As for reshading and revising the in-level backgrounds, I implore you to DO NOT REMOVE the pictures that show all the enemies from the previous Keen games. If they are removed, asses will be kicked! :wormouth
It is your mod, Ceilick, so you have every right to revise it in any way you see fit. But since you originally began this thread with the intention of getting input from the rest of the community, please allow me to give you mine. Your feelings on keeping true to the original may have changed, but mine have not. Just in case I did not make it crystal clear how I felt about the revision in the past, I have pasted various quotes I made earlier in the thread concerning this revision.

I am not opposed to revising TKOK. I am not opposed to you making a "TKOK Plus" (like you did with Keen Dreams). I am not opposed to you making TKOK on par with DITD and BOTB. But I am opposed to drastic and major edits and revisions. In other words, if you butcher TKOK to the point where it is almost unrecognizable, there is a good chance I might be unwilling to play it.

Maybe if I was a modder I would be a little more sympathetic and more understanding of your need for full creative control over your mods. I know if I was a modder I would creative my mods the way Keenrush does. I would make them in almost complete secret, release it to the community with a "take or leave it" attitude, and to those who do not like it, that is their tough shyt!!!

Usually I agree with you on most things Keen, but this time you and I do not quite see eye-to-eye on this.

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Post by Ceilick » Mon May 23, 2011 20:40

...the point where it is almost unrecognizable
No one will be able to play the revision without seeing the original in it. Nothing will be so new that people would have to guess this is derived from tkok.

Examples of some of the 'major' changes I'm thinking about:

Key carriers will have a complete different design, something with a more 'magical machine' look than just "mechanical machine" to better reflect the game's setting. This goes the same most mechanical objects: background terminals and computers, the vorticon style car, the vehicle used by the Crank, etc.

I'm planning to completely redesign the Krodacian Magi's animation, though it'll behave the same.

I'm planning to make significant changes to the world map so that it is less like keen 4 in design, though there will still have designated areas: blue forest, mushroom forest, and water zone.

I'm planning to replace most interior 'household' graphics in favor of more alien looking objects (though they may serve the same purposes as their earthly counterparts).

The end story sequence along with the scrolling story sequence will be completely redesigned. The game's story, however, will remain the same: Message from Mortimer, go to Krodacia to find the keys, go into UTC and get blasted to Calidune.

There will be level revisions. I'm unsure what specifically or how extensively, but I can say with certainty that it'll happen.

And other things probably. As I said before, I'm not actively working on this (myriad of other projects) but this is the way I want to do it. I get that there are going to be tkok purists who aren't gonna like some of these changes. You guys have the original to enjoy. I want to make something I can enjoy that I feel better suits the trilogy.

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Post by Eros » Mon May 23, 2011 21:42

please please PLEASE do not revise the krodacian magi's animation to the point that it appears more evolved, then i would have to make another plasticine figurine. not that i'm opposed to it if it turns out okay.

could you change both the water and the slurple? slimeblobs aren't exactly enemies that can jump superhuman lengths.

the water i'm thinking should be poisonous/boiling, keen (supposedly) already has a mechanism to protect against water.
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Post by 9montkor » Tue May 24, 2011 10:08

lemm wrote:New songs would be nice. Maybe some that aren't so menacing =). The world map song is very nice, and the quiet outdoors has a good style, although it could be less repetitive.

The outdoors panoramic background tiles are really good, I don't think you need to change those at all, or anything in the outdoors levels for that matter.

The theme I liked the least was the red indoors, because no level really stood out (It also didn't help that all of them were houses/mansions/places of residence :p). I think that if you just restricted certain graphical elements to certain levels (for example, keep all the pictures in just one level, don't use the blue wall paper in another), then each level would be more memorable.

Maybe one of the houses could be a warehouse or office, or some other place of work.
About the new songs I tried installing it but when i did the music was not on. I went to configer put it on and it went back off just telling you.

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