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Duplex
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Version PCKF

Post by Duplex » Tue Sep 11, 2012 4:57

I propose a small community project for those not currently working on any big projects at the moment; a series of revisions for Keen 1 - 6 that addresses the flaws in the original games. It will be similar to that Keen 3 level pack I made last year, only you guys will have the final say on the design changes this time. We will address the flaws of the original games one level at a time.

Since we will be starting with Keen 1, which of these levels do you feel should be changed first? If not Border Town, then which one after that? If we do come to a consensus that Keen 1 doesn't need to be changed, we can skip right ahead to Keen 2.

Ceilick
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Post by Ceilick » Tue Sep 11, 2012 8:07

It's hard to agree on what should be fixed or changed and what shouldn't, especially in level design, and there will always be those who want to preserve everything about the originals, flaws included. Keen Dreams Plus, for example, was a fun personal project for me to 'fix' and improve on Keen Dreams, but it's where the project diverges significantly from the original that it's the most fun.

It's my opinion that making the 'ideal', 'fixed', etc, version of the game isn't feasible and just won't be that fun to actually play.

This reminds me, however, of something I've thought about for some time: versions of the games which are optimized for level packs. This means: tile property cleanup, tile organization cleanup, graphical fixes, additional tiles for functionality and content.

For example, an optimized Keen 4 would include graphical fixes, additional tiles from the keen 4 demo as well as tiles from projects like Bubbatom's Nine Accumulators.

This would provide an awesome community resource for a variety of projects, including the type you're suggesting.

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Duplex
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Post by Duplex » Tue Sep 11, 2012 21:45

To be honest, I only want to change Keen 2 and 3 since those are the ones that receive the most criticism. I know I already did Keen 3, but that was done without a change log nor much implementation of the community's feedback. I even took out the balls and jacks despite you guys asking me to put them back in. =P

To get the ball rolling, I'll start with Keen 2 since I think Keen 1 is too timeless to mess with. Here's a list of Keen 2's levels. If some of you aren't familiar with KeenWiki, each entry on the list has an image of the entire level. If any of you see any objective flaws with these levels, feel free to chime in and tell me.

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Duplex
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Post by Duplex » Sat Sep 15, 2012 1:50

Today, I decided to look at one of the most infamous levels in Keen 2, Weaprony A. In this level, if you so much as collect those two cans stacked on top of each other, you cannot beat the level. I made some adjustments so that you don't have to worry about that anymore.

The red robots in the game can stick to every surface except those skinny platforms. Instead, they simply walk off of them. These platforms serve as a much better alternative than the cans since the cans disappear forever upon being collected.

Benvolio
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Post by Benvolio » Sat Sep 15, 2012 13:27

Nice work Duplex on that crazy level, looks like you've ironed out the "Benvolio Bug" [forgive me for my pompousness] - you know, this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xY2Sj7xl60A

This 'WA' level was in its original state a puzzle, with the collection of those cans as a pitfall which one may only resolve with self-sacrifice. This is not necessarily to be considered poor level design on the part of id. In fact, I would rate the level design in Keen2 as among the finest in the Keen series. Keen1 is timeless as you say; Keen2 is solid in a different way, and its level scenarios are almost as unforgettable as those in Keen1.

On the other hand, Keen3... sigh.

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tulip
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Post by tulip » Mon Sep 17, 2012 21:41

well my first thought was: oh man he layed hands on the best puzzle in the vorticons series. but considering the door bug this may actually be an improvement, although it's much easier now.
Image You crack me up little buddy!

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