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Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 13:12
by VikingBoyBilly
Okay, you people don't know what a 2.5D game is (just like you didn't know what RPGs are) so I have to be the lecturing professor and spiel off the unbendable, iron-clad encyclopedia definition as printed in the ancient tome of sacred commandments.

2.5D is a game engine with explorable height, depth, and width in gameplay, but the maps are on a 2D grid with gimmicky limitations preventing natural bridges and overlapping areas on one dimension (the .5 dimension). This is distinct from 5D games that can have overlapping architecture occupying the same space, but these overlapping spaces cannot be directly connected and there are no natural bridges. Absoultely nothing is 3D. All map objects are sprite based with texture-based architecture. There are no 3D models. So Duke Nukem 64 is a disgraceful bastardization of something that was once hailed with the prestigious title "2.5D."

Any questions? :disguised

Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 19:52
by Roobar
Professor, while your statement about Duke Nukem is correct, you missed the point that 2.5D here in Keen 2.5D is used as a term describing a gameplay in an a three-dimensional video game that is restricted to a two-dimensional plane. Therefore, there are 3D models, but the camera perspective is limited to two and a half dimensions. So we CAN call it 2.5D Keen, even though it's not using sprites.

Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:38
by chrissifniotis
Ronnie wrote:Here's the new head I came up with. Whatchew think? Vorticon enough?
Image
He looks rather like an angry attack dog, but I like how he's come out.

Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:02
by Keening_Product
What wiivn said.

Also, I really like that face. Seems a good fit for Lt. Barker.

Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 20:30
by Nospike
I think it looks way too realistic, not cartoony enough.

Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 4:19
by Gridlock
I kind of agree about the realism. That Vorticon looks pretty fierce. It might be good for the vorticon commander or Barker, but it doesn't seem quite right for a grunt. The final version of the snout still seems a little too doglike (I did like the proportions and curvature a lot in the unfinished model a few posts back: Wed Jun 25, 2014 19:48) Maybe the best thing would be to change the snout and make the eyes bigger to give it a more cartoonish look. Also, how would it look with a slightly thinner neck?

This is super cool seeing these Keen characters come to life. Keep up the great work.

Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 21:30
by VikingBoyBilly
wiivn wrote:Professor, while your statement about Duke Nukem is correct, you missed the point that 2.5D here in Keen 2.5D is used as a term describing a gameplay in an a three-dimensional video game that is restricted to a two-dimensional plane. Therefore, there are 3D models, but the camera perspective is limited to two and a half dimensions. So we CAN call it 2.5D Keen, even though it's not using sprites.
It's still 3D. If it used 2D sprites, but maintained the 3D backgrounds, it might almost be approaching it, maybe 2.75D at most, but no. It's still that Yoshi's Story garg. If the backgrounds (and even foregrounds) are capable of having depth and were created with 3d modeling tools and such, it is 3D. End of Story. I WILL NOT be putting Hexen on the same caliber of Yoshi's story! Do you not realize what an atrocious disgrace that game is, or to even be forced to associate with it? So no. I will not accept that pitiful, :barf disgraceful, :barf disgusting, :barf easy, :barf short, :barf sugary coated slop :barf Yoshi's story as part of Hexen's canon universe. And I don't want commander keen tainted by it's reputation, either.

Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2014 11:05
by Nospike
I remember playing that once through Project64, the graphics were horribly glitchy and I don't even remember wtf the story was about. :o

Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 23:03
by Ronnie
Image

After bringing in the Keen model into the scene I realized I need to stunt his proportions quite a bit. The result is much closer to what I had envisioned when I started.

Concerning the level of realism, I'm working on the high-resolution sculpt. I use the sculpts to create normal and ambient occlusion maps, which help me texture the model. I try and make my sculpts twice as 'realistic' as the eventual final product, because all that detail just gets baked into a flat texture. The final model will be much closer to the Keen model in terms of resolution, which (I hope) will make the Vorticon more cartoony and on style.

As for the 2.5D side conversation, I donno, man, Keen 2.5D just sounded good to me!

Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 5:39
by chrissifniotis
Cool, I'd say the Voricon's height is more or less spot on, I can't be entirely sure if it's the case but I've always felt them being a whole head taller than Keen.

Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:44
by Ronnie
Image

Here's the game res version with an ambient occlusion bake on it.

Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:23
by Keening_Product
I look forward to seeing it in colour and in the game!

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 23:25
by Ronnie
Image

Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:21
by Keening_Product
Keening approves this Product. Nice work.

Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 6:53
by chrissifniotis
I wanna see him run and jump. Keep up the great work. :D