Help wanted: building a SSB moveset for Keen and Mortimer

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chrissifniotis
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Help wanted: building a SSB moveset for Keen and Mortimer

Post by chrissifniotis »

As some may know by now I'm developing a Super Smash Brothers moveset for Commander Keen, I also intend to introduce Mortimer McMire by creating another moveset for him. I'm reaching a point where I can begin writing an in-depth description of how each of their movesets work, their effects and how best to apply them in a SSB battle, as well as their differences and how they fight each other. I'm currently at work right now so I can't provide any details, but when I return I'd like to go over what I have for Keen as well as brainstorm any more ideas for Mortimer, what I have now seems a bit empty.

The reason I'm asking is because I very much like to represent the characters as best as possible and I've come to respect the members opinions here.
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troublesomekeen
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Post by troublesomekeen »

Erm. Who does this work? Is this going to be a Flash game?
What are the controls? Does it work like SuperSmashBrothers64? Melee? Or Brawl?
So there's Up, Down, Right, Left. (Movement; arrow keys)
A for Attack (Punch, kick)
B for Special (Shoot blaster)
C for Jump
Z for Shield (Defense)
R for Grab
L for Taunt (Mooning Keen)

And then there's Directional buttons combined with Action buttons to trigger even more moves, am I right?

A+Right(or Left) for slower but higher powered attacking moves
Down+B to activate Pogo Stick
Up+B for some kind of extra jump
Z+Right(or Left) to Dodge

Is that basically how it goes? If I understand the gameplay, controls, what and how many buttons there are, then we can get some cool moves in there.
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Roobar
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Post by Roobar »

I don't even know what moveset means and you want us to help. Show in more details what you need, examples, etc.
chrissifniotis
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Post by chrissifniotis »

troublesomekeen wrote:Erm. Who does this work? Is this going to be a Flash game?
What are the controls? Does it work like SuperSmashBrothers64? Melee? Or Brawl?

...

Is that basically how it goes? If I understand the gameplay, controls, what and how many buttons there are, then we can get some cool moves in there.
Okay, first of all Super Smash Flash 2 - I'm assuming you saw the signature - is a developing PC version of Smash. There is a suggestion that when the full version releases there is the ability to create one's own characters, so I've been developing Keen and Mortimer movesets ever since that, admittedly, rumor.
They are meant to play like Brawl characters, they have certain special abilities in some of their attacks, the Neural Stunner being a very obvious example. Keen also has an additional bonus; when he does a midair jump, called a second jump, he pogos in midair and anyone caught directly under the pogo is dealt a massive Meteor Strike attack downward, no damage but huge downward knockback. Mortimer has his ingenious Mind Belts as a Neutral Special attack that can literally hijack control of one fighter to Mortimer at the cost of leaving Mortimer entirely vulnerable to other fighters and the attempts from the victim to break free.
Both characters also have Final Smashes; Keen has GOD MODE - an as yet undetermined amount of time of invulnerability with the God cheat and all attacks triple in damage strength. Mortimer has the Mangling Machine - he, or rather his android dummy, comes out in the Mangling Machine and moves around, stomps the ground and can swing his arms dealing massive damage and knockback. However, especially with Free-For-All games with more than two fighters, the Mangling Machine is also the only Final Smash that can be defeated by the other fighter(s) by destroying the six sparks and the heart before the time expires.

In essence I want Keen and Mortimer to play differently; where Keen uses his gadgets and rely more on the effects of his arsenal more than actually make contact with fighters, Mortimer is a great deal more a brawny physical fighter, even using a pogo as a hammer to slam into other fighters. I won't bore you with details but below is the current movesets of characters;

-Keen-
Neutral Attack - Jab
Special Attack - Boobus Bomb
Dash Attack (Attack when tapping Left or Right) - Trip
Floor Attack (Attack when lying on the Ground) - Jump Kick
Ledge Attack (Attack when hanging from a Ledge) - Headbutt Charge
-
Side Tilt (Left or Right + tapping Attack. A tilt-able Attack) - Punch
Up Tilt (Up + tapping Attack) - Headbutt
Down Tilt (Down + tapping Attack) - Kick
Side Smash (Left or Right + Attack) - Vortican HyperPistol (can be charged to fire more powerful shots)
Up Smash (Up + Attack) - Pogo Headbutt
Down Smash (Down + Attack) - Pogo Swing
Side Special (Left or Right + Special) - Neural Stunner (can be charged to fire more powerful shots that stun fighters for longer)
Up Special (Up + Special) - Impossible Pogo
Down Special (Down + Special) - Pogo Smash
-
Grab
Pummel (Attack after Grab) - Helmet Slam
Forward Throw (Attack after Grab in the Forward direction) - Throw
Back Throw (Attack after Grab in the Backward direction) - Hammer Throw
Up Throw - (Up + Attack after Grab) - Pogo Throw
Down Throw - (Down + Attack after Grab) - Slam
-
Aerial Attack (Attack in the Air) - Pogo Spinkick
Forward Aerial (Attack in the Air in the Forward direction) - Pogo Stunner
Back Aerial (Attack in the Air in the Backward direction) - Pogo Kick
Up Aerial (Up + Attack in the Air) - Aerial Headbutt
Down Aerial (Down + Attack in the Air) - Pogo Drop
|Taunts|
Taunt - Pulls out a K flag and plants it into the ground.
Side Taunt - Pulls down his pants and moons from Keen 4 in the Pyramids of the Moons.
Down Taunt - Sits down and reads.

-Mortimer-
Neutral Attack - Punch
Special Attack - Mind Belt
Dash Attack - Low Kick
Floor Attack - Low Roundhouse
Ledge Attack - Sideswipe
-
Side Tilt - Headbutt Slam
Up Tilt - Head Kick
Down Tilt - Kick
Side Smash - Raygun (from Keen 1)
Up Smash - Pogo Hammer
Down Smash - Pogo Spin
Side Special - Brain Blaster
Up Special - Rocket Punch
Down Special - Knee Kick
-
Grab
Pummel - Helmet Crunch
Forward Throw - Throw
Back Throw - Swirly
Up Throw - Rocket Slam
Down Throw - Kneecapper
-
Aerial Attack - Pogo Swing
Forward Aerial - Rocket Blaster
Back Aerial - Rocket Roundhouse
Up Aerial - Rocket Kick
Down Aerial - Rocket Crash
|Taunts|
Taunt - Evil laughs.
Side Taunt - Points to the closest hostile fighter yelling 'You must die!'.
Down Taunt - Takes out his Raygun and fires at the middle of the screen, cracking it.
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Post by tulip »

chrissifniotis wrote: Taunt - Pulls out a K flag and plants it into the ground.
I like that one.
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Post by Levellass »

Agreed.
What you really need, not what you think you ought to want.
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Post by troublesomekeen »

Really awesome stuff, man. I can't tell you how much of a fan I am. But I'll start by saying I'm a fan! A fan I am! And oh my goodness, I completely forgot about the "K Flag". I will have to make sure I use it in my Tactical Strategy Keen Game. I just watch the Suburb Shenanigans demo video again. Keen puts the flags in mailboxes after completing a leve. Pure genius that Bubbatom.

Mortimer and Keen are too similar to get very different move-sets from the two. They're about the same height, same IQ, same-ish appearance, and about the same age.

On the other hand, it is not known whether Mort has a Pogo of his own. I love the idea of summoning things, like Mortimer unleashing the Mangling Machine. The more you incorporate creatures and machines from the keeniverse, the better. Take the Tater Trooper for instance:
http://youtu.be/BTF-R_jc8ow?t=47s
Instead of Tater using a Pogo Stick, he pulls out a Tomatooth (from nowhere) to bounce around on. This way I've included two creatures (Tater and Tomatooth) in one character. That's why when Keen pulls out the K Flag, it's awesome! Because it connects Keen and the flag.
I wonder if Mortimer created Spindreds. He could use those to bounce on.

Anyways, Keen and Mort are very same-y, but there's little else to choose from. Princess Lindsey instead of Mort? Hmmm... Nah, she doesn't do much. Seeing the Mangling Machine drop into the level is more worthwhile.

EDIT: Oh, by the way. Is GOD MODE going to put a bubble around Keen (when he gets an ankh)?

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I think that would be extra cool.
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chrissifniotis
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Post by chrissifniotis »

troublesomekeen wrote:Really awesome stuff, man. I can't tell you how much of a fan I am. But I'll start by saying I'm a fan! A fan I am!...

Mortimer and Keen are too similar to get very different move-sets from the two. They're about the same height, same IQ, same-ish appearance, and about the same age.

...

Anyways, Keen and Mort are very same-y, but there's little else to choose from. Princess Lindsey instead of Mort? Hmmm... Nah, she doesn't do much. Seeing the Mangling Machine drop into the level is more worthwhile.

EDIT: Oh, by the way. Is GOD MODE going to put a bubble around Keen (when he gets an ankh)?

I think that would be extra cool.
Thanks man. To me, while Keen by himself is good, matching him with a enemy just seemed more natural. Yes, the two are very similar - their height, weight and fall speed are exactly the same, but it strikes me as making less sense to use, say, a Berkeloid from 4 or a Shikadi from 5, and even less sense to pit Keen with someone like Linsey or any of the Guardians of the Oracle.
I will say however that the closest other enemy worth going for would be a Vorticon, given the range of the enemies it may be worth trying to amalgamate the abilities into another moveset. Hm, gives me something new to think about.
Maybe, but chances are no primarily due to the fact that along with the characters I intend to add a few items and possibly at least one Keen stage; the Ankh is one of the items I plan to add, and everything it entails.
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Post by troublesomekeen »

Mayhap perchance you might make a character like Pokemon Trainer:

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Last edited by troublesomekeen on Tue Jul 11, 2017 7:14, edited 1 time in total.
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Commander Keen in... Canteloupe Quest!
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Post by chrissifniotis »

troublesomekeen wrote:Mayhap perchance you might make a character like Pokemon Trainer:

Image
Maybe, I'll need to start looking at the different Vorticons in the first episode and consider all the possible abilities and actions they have, I'll do that once I finish fine-tuning the damage and effects each part of Keen's and Mortimer's moveset deals. In the meantime there is another Trainer-like character I'm weighing up, but not from Keen.
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Post by troublesomekeen »

chrissifniotis wrote:Maybe, I'll need to start looking at the different Vorticons in the first episode and consider all the possible abilities and actions they have...
Against all odds, Vorticon Mom is the most diverse character, in my opinion. She's got a sharp pair of claws, teaching vortikids the alphabet, and breathes fireballs.
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Post by chrissifniotis »

troublesomekeen wrote:Against all odds, Vorticon Mom is the most diverse character, in my opinion. She's got a sharp pair of claws, teaching vortikids the alphabet, and breathes fireballs.
Mm, it's a good start; I can definitely see a number of side attacks - even a good ledge attack. I'll need more info though, but in due time.
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Post by mortimermcmirestinks »

Are there Smash Balls? I can imagine Keen's Final Smash being Jump Cheat plus God Mode and Mortimer's being the Mangling Machine and/or possible summoning hordes of Vorticons.
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Post by chrissifniotis »

mortimermcmirestinks wrote:Are there Smash Balls? I can imagine Keen's Final Smash being Jump Cheat plus God Mode and Mortimer's being the Mangling Machine and/or possible summoning hordes of Vorticons.
Yep, Keen and Mortimer have final smashes and you've essentially nailed them; Keen has God Mode and the Jump Cheat and Mortimer has a slow but movable Mangling Machine.
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