Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

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Roobar
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Roobar » Fri Nov 29, 2019 21:22

I think the first tileset is really cool, but I thought that you didn't utilize its full potential.

Image

So I've been inspired by it and in the last few days this happened:

Image Image

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Syllypryde » Sat Nov 30, 2019 14:23

Wow...
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Kohntarkosz_ » Sat Nov 30, 2019 16:55

Beta 0.2 is up. Link is here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1Xx3KN ... ttMpOt1ebw I have fixed the game-breaking platform issue in level 2, and attempted to fix the riot-cop clipping issue, but I think I may just have to make sure he doesn't show up near 45˚ slopes.

Roobar, that is simply spectacular. Good work as always!

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by K1n9_Duk3 » Sat Nov 30, 2019 22:54

The new version seems to fix this issue:
Image

However, the enemy could still get stuck at the top of the slope. But I managed to fix that with a minor edit to the level layout:
Image

The hitbox itself is fine now, just make sure there is enough headroom for the enemies.
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Syllypryde » Sun Dec 01, 2019 18:53

The game completely locks up when I go into the teleporter. The same issue that Mirror Menace has.
What is Directive X_M?

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by szemi » Sun Dec 01, 2019 19:40

Probably due to changing the tileplace of the teleporter. In short: I think teleporter must be untouched, but modified in graphic.
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Syllypryde » Sun Dec 01, 2019 20:18

szemi wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 19:40
Probably due to changing the tileplace of the teleporter. In short: I think teleporter must be untouched, but modified in graphic.
Rick's teleporter works just fine
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Roobar » Sun Dec 01, 2019 20:29

Even with the platform fixed, I'm still stuck at level 2 and that level cannot be beaten or at least I cannot figure a way out with Rick or even Keen.

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Syllypryde » Sun Dec 01, 2019 21:56

Roobar wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 20:29
Even with the platform fixed, I'm still stuck at level 2 and that level cannot be beaten or at least I cannot figure a way out with Rick or even Keen.
You are on Cell Block Beta right? Where exactly are you getting stuck on each level? Were you able to get the yellow and red gems for Keen? The green and red gems for Rick?
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by szemi » Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:29

Syllypryde wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 20:18
szemi wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 19:40
Probably due to changing the tileplace of the teleporter. In short: I think teleporter must be untouched, but modified in graphic.
Rick's teleporter works just fine
KeenGraph has a few interesting issues that are not fixed yet... >.>
Yeah, piece of cake!

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by TheBigV » Tue Dec 03, 2019 19:24

There's a green keygem in the second area of the second level that's needed to finish the level as Rick:
Image
However, the keygem is too high to reach on any difficulty other than Easy.

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Kohntarkosz_ » Wed Dec 04, 2019 17:46

New beta is up which should circumvent most or all of the issues in level 2 (see top post)

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6

Post by Syllypryde » Wed Dec 04, 2019 21:25

Call me slow. I should have posted the issues I found before you updated the Beta to 0.3. In each version of The Courthouse they are both unsolvable. In Keen’s version you need one each of the four colored gems to open doors. You have two blue gems and no yellow gem. Plus there is a long pole with rotating sections with a switch at the top that opens a bridge directly below. This pole as far as I can tell is impossible to get up without dying, unless there is some weird trick I don’t know about.

In Rick’s version it seems impossible to get the red gem because none of the doorways lead to the doorway that is the only access to the room where the red gem is located. Also when you place the green and red gems in their gem holders it immediately exits out of the game.

In Rick’s version of Tiny Town, not only is it impossible to get the green gem but also impossible to get back out of the room because there are no goplats or horizontal poles allowing Rick to jump back up. Because this is a Keen6 mod, I used the Impossible Bullet trick to collect the green gem and jump to the top to get out of the room. Also the entrance text and the information box for this level show Bloog Aeronautics and Space Administration and BASA respectively.

Also secret and hidden areas are secret and hidden areas for a reason. In some levels, especially in Rick’s version, some of the hidden areas have different shading to show exactly where they are, yet without using the F10-Y cheat. In my opinion it defeats the whole purpose of even having secret and hidden areas if you going to add specific shading to identity them. They should be hidden.

In A-Danac Express there are three goplats in the first section. One vertical just above a rail car and two horizontal at the very top. The first switch doeson’t work. It does not activate any of these goplats and one switch certainly cannot activate all three. The second switch takes Keen to the second section once he exits the rail car he is in. Also in this level as well as East Tundra Town you still have the Queen Vivas instead of the CryptoCoin backup drives.

In at least two levels, the Impound Lot and The Greenhouse, despite the fact that Rick supposedly cannot climb poles, the sections of vertical poles that are hidden in structures Rick can jump up these poles as if they are horizontal poles. Was this intentional?
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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by proYorp » Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:01

I've been testing this the last couple of days, I'm almost done with my playthrough as Keen, need to start editing the videos soon, but there's a few big issues I should probably report now.

Some of the levels toward the end have been unwinnable without the use of cheats. Syllypryde already detailed the critical problems I've run into in The Courthouse level, but there was another one in West Tundra Town. There are two bridges next to each other, and two switches that affect both of them. It seems to be impossible to be able to both climb onto them and walk across the longer one on the right to where you need to go, as only one of them can be open at a time. I'm guessing one of the switches is supposed to only affect the one on the right, in which case it would be possible to synchronise them.

I've been able to bypass most of these problems with the help of cheats, except for one that I've just run into. I used no-clip to be able to access the secret level (I think the issue with the teleport crashing the game has already been reported) but upon trying to enter I see the default level entry text (for Bloog Control Center) and as soon as the level loads I just see a black screen and instantly hear the death tone, then the level appears for a brief moment before it does the same thing again.
I tried loading the level on a new game (my save file was transferred between versions, so I'm not sure if that affects anything) but then it just gives the black screen, dies, and just hangs.
My first guess is to check if the level has a player sprite actually set anywhere (I'd check myself but I don't currently have easy access to a level editor).


Kohntarkosz_ wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 15:58
1. Find an UNZLEXE'd copy of keen6.exe (if you don't have one handy, send your two bits to the Apogee Software distribution office on the outskirts of Dallas and they'll mail it to you on a floppy...at least I *assume* it still works like that.)
It should be noted that while the only Shareware episode of Goodbye Galaxy is Episode 4, most people treat Episode 6 as abandonware, because no-one is really sure who owns the rights to it and it is no longer sold anywhere (it's not in the collection on Steam). Due to this, people aren't as strict about distributing the executable, and IIRC all Keen 6 mods I've played already contained it. Additionally, it's a lot harder to obtain a copy, and I know several people have said they don't even have Keen 6. (Plus not everyone has the technical know-how to decompress the .EXE, although there are ways to help with this: Ceilick's "Battle of the Brains" did so by supplying a copy of UNZLEXE to use and a batch file to prepare it, and I believe the latest version of CKPATCH does not require the executable to be decompressed.)
If there is a frequent difference in executables that is causing glitches to occur, it could be advisable to consider supplying the file yourself.
"Friendly. Very friendly. Too friendly." :yorp

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Re: Announcement 2 of 2: Beta testers required for a new Keen 6 mod

Post by Syllypryde » Fri Dec 06, 2019 12:38

proYorp wrote: ...but there was another one in West Tundra Town. There are two bridges next to each other, and two switches that affect both of them. It seems to be impossible to be able to both climb onto them and walk across the longer one on the right to where you need to go, as only one of them can be open at a time. I'm guessing one of the switches is supposed to only affect the one on the right, in which case it would be possible to synchronise them...
West Tundra Town is solvable without cheats. On the double bridge section you can do it without both bridges open. There is a trick unique to Keen 6 you cannot do in Keens 4-5. In Keens 4-5 you push up to flip a switch. In Keen 6 you have to jump in order to flip the switches. When you want to flip a switch down you jump on top of it. You can actually use a switch to jump off of to get extra height on your jump.

On the double bridge section make sure to flip both switches up. The right switch activates the right bridge. Then use the "impossible" pogo trick to jump off the left switch in order to grab the ledge at the right hand bridge. It might take a few tries to get the jump right, but you can do it. I have faith in you.
proYorp wrote: I've been able to bypass most of these problems with the help of cheats, except for one that I've just run into. I used no-clip to be able to access the secret level (I think the issue with the teleport crashing the game has already been reported) but upon trying to enter I see the default level entry text (for Bloog Control Center) and as soon as the level loads I just see a black screen and instantly hear the death tone, then the level appears for a brief moment before it does the same thing again.
I tried loading the level on a new game (my save file was transferred between versions, so I'm not sure if that affects anything) but then it just gives the black screen, dies, and just hangs.
My first guess is to check if the level has a player sprite actually set anywhere (I'd check myself but I don't currently have easy access to a level editor).
Kohntarkosz_ wrote: Levels: Every Keen6 level slot has been used. Three levels are only playable as Rick; another three are only playable as Keen; most of the others have separate rick-only and keen-only areas (or, e.g., areas which must be explored left-to-right as Keen and right-to-left as Rick.)
As the mod creator has said there "supposed to be" 3 levels specific for each character. West Tundra Mountains is specific to Keen. East Tundra Mountains is specific to Rick. The Courthouse (Level 13) is specific to Keen. The Courthouse (Level 14) is specific to Rick. Currently for this release of the Beta, Level 15 Planet Toronto is specific to Rick. When you try play this level as Keen, either from using the F10-N clip cheat to go to the level as you did, or using the F10-W warp cheat to go to Level 15, you get the Bloog Control Center entrance text and Keen immediately dies. Like I said, Planet Toronto is a Rick specific level right now, which makes no sense. Because if Keen cannot play this level anyway, it makes A Cliff? where Keen gets the cop uniform and having him go through the teleporter completely useless. My guess is the Keen part of the level may not have been designed yet.

If you try to play Keen specific levels as Rick, or vice versa, the levels do not play right. Either you die immediately, like you do in Level 15, or you immediately complete the level because of Keen or Rick starting on the opposite side of the level instead of starting where the specific character is supposed to start.
ProYorp wrote: It should be noted that while the only Shareware episode of Goodbye Galaxy is Episode 4, most people treat Episode 6 as abandonware, because no-one is really sure who owns the rights to it and it is no longer sold anywhere (it's not in the collection on Steam). Due to this, people aren't as strict about distributing the executable, and IIRC all Keen 6 mods I've played already contained it. Additionally, it's a lot harder to obtain a copy, and I know several people have said they don't even have Keen 6. (Plus not everyone has the technical know-how to decompress the .EXE, although there are ways to help with this: Ceilick's "Battle of the Brains" did so by supplying a copy of UNZLEXE to use and a batch file to prepare it, and I believe the latest version of CKPATCH does not require the executable to be decompressed.)
If there is a frequent difference in executables that is causing glitches to occur, it could be advisable to consider supplying the file yourself.
If already have any of the Keen6 mods such as Dead in the Desert, Aliens Ate My Babysiter... Again, The Rapid Pack, Keen10 Mirror Menace etc. then you should already have an Unlzexed version of Keen 6. Just go into the directory of either one of these mods and copy that version of Keen6 into the directory of The Prisoner's Dilemma. Besides, if you are a big enough fan of Commander Keen that you are actually playing mods, then you most likely already have copies of all 7 of the original games including Keen6.

There was another issue I wanted to report concerning your Nospike replacement. As Keen he works fine, but when you are playing as Rick he is positioned above ground. He doesn't move at all until you shoot him once. As soon as you do he takes two steps in mid air, the question mark appears above him and he falls to his death. Positioning him above the ground makes him useless because he is no threat at all.
What is Directive X_M?

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