Video by 2 Players

All discussion about the Commander Genius project (a Keen interpreter + more).
gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Sun Jan 07, 2018 20:08

Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05

I have not designed levels outside of Jetpack and Starcraft,
but i have tinkered with Textures and Sprites a long while,and made skins mods for a long time.
So I'll stick to character sprites and tile tweaks ^.^
Okay, cool let's use that potential then... :-)
Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05

Yes, which can be seen for the most part the in the tile texture.
But somethings stands out due to too many colors of shade or washed down colors
notable: Slug statue, Stone hut, Sand Dunes background, Forest Tree background
(although a heat over the Sand Dunes would be great!)

Here is a comparison:
Image
A: 4 Colors - Original
B: 7 Colors - Changed Zigzag-shadding into a new color, adding 3 new shades in between the original 4 - manual edit
C: 231 Colors, Holy macaroni! o.0

BTW I don't think they look that different in HDX
Might be, but I like the one with 7 colors the most for the Keen games. The four color ones original came through the hardware limitations. It's also nice though and agreed with HDX not so much different.
Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05

Indeed, I don't see a reason to add a large roster of character's available without a character selection
which i don't see a reason to implement before online play have become a thing
so that can stay on the shelf till then, and instead add 2 additional player characters to Keen 1 and 4 Specials.
Character selection I had in mind and the code is pretty much prepared for that. I can do that as next task if you wish. Basically I only require an extra menu and that's it. The character have no special abilities so the engine loads the sprites depending on one how one variable is set anyways, like it does with the other players. Nonetheless for multiple players I think every player should choose it's sprite when the game starts.
Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05


Very Interesting, getting a bit more similar to the Doom source engines ^.^
where you only need the .wad Data files: Scripts/Sound/Sprites/Maps.
sounds like possible Bio menace support down the road.

Hmmm... one of the thing i would like to see The Invasion of Vorticons remakes is the zap shot
to play it's animation vertical (use a variant sprite) when hot up or downward, instead of Left and right, Possible?
I'll find and pack the sprites if you want tinker to with them.
That is no problem at. If you send me some sprites, I will put them in. How about let CG rotate them in place by 90° when shot up or down? Or do you prefer different sprites at all?

I once had the idea of shooting diagonally, like using the mouse to point, but I think that would be very game breaking and too far from the original. What do you think?

Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05

I believe the Co-op feature could attract the attention of users, over defaulting to dosbox on PC
Maybe also get some of the youtuber's in on the Idea as that will show to their viewers that Keen co-op
Shikadi-Network, XrackProject (Both Germans) and Hairmonster12 ('Merica'n)

Maybe you'll show us more of your idea for you Keenish game in the future? ^.~
Don't worry, I will :-) More videos will come showing more features. About Keenish there is no special mission brief or plan. I think it will come and merge into one piece someday. Depending on what will be liked and what not and how this community will evolve and what my time will allow to do... I like to think how Freedoom came to be. It is a nice alternative to Doom. Or maybe someone has a great idea which would run on CG. I'm open for that. Or my wife or a friend comes up with some ideas about our crazy life and we put it into the game :-D.
Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05

From Keen 4, yes
Outside of the Council page, whom hide in the story text and the ending sequence of keen 4
(he is also technically in Keens Dream intro story, and is just as useful...)
but she is much more remembered, giving her role for giving Keen Hints: where to find the Wetsuit and the Secret Level.

Anyone who have completed Keen 1, knows who Spot is
which also makes Spot a natural choice for Invasion of the Vorticons in co-op

Keen talks to the Council page once arriving in the shadow lands
it is likely the Page wants to tag along, to make up for calling keen "Captain Keen"
Image

The question about Lindsey is really; Should she wear her Dress as in Keen 4 or Pants like in Netkeen?
Image
The Dress is nice and if Princess Peach can run through levels with a Dress, why not her?
On the other hand pants should be better for running in jumping in generaö. I like the pants a bit better, but only a small bit. What do you prefer?
Having fun developing stuff...

User avatar
Zilem
Vortininja
Posts: 178
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 2:50
Location: Europe; Denmark
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by Zilem » Mon Jan 08, 2018 17:34

gerstrong wrote: Might be, but I like the one with 7 colors the most for the Keen games. The four color ones original came through the hardware limitations. It's also nice though and agreed with HDX not so much different.
Erm.... I forgot to mention, that the 3rd was from the Keen 4 plus's gfx folder <.<;

Indeed 4-bit color EGA, which would make this 5-Bit color SEGA haha'h XD
8-Bit guy have some interesting videos on about retro Hardware including; CGA, composite mode and EGA

One exception to the Original palette would probably be Bio Menace characters.
Image
as the right looks great, better then expected actually...
gerstrong wrote: Character selection I had in mind and the code is pretty much prepared for that. I can do that as next task if you wish. Basically I only require an extra menu and that's it. The character have no special abilities so the engine loads the sprites depending on one how one variable is set anyways, like it does with the other players. Nonetheless for multiple players I think every player should choose it's sprite when the game starts.
Sounds like you get the character selection screen, after you have chosen then player amount

Indeed that makes sense for multi-player, maybe the Pallette swap could come if 2 or more are using the same player sprite
or instead make each character limited to 1 and display an error, like: "A Player have already chosen that character"
for online, that would be the duplicate sprites that aren't the player's sprites character on the screen
if possible of course.
gerstrong wrote: That is no problem at. If you send me some sprites, I will put them in. How about let CG rotate them in place by 90° when shot up or down? Or do you prefer different sprites at all?

I once had the idea of shooting diagonally, like using the mouse to point, but I think that would be very game breaking and too far from the original. What do you think?
Huh, that sounds even better!, Here's the files

You have to have a Aim system a'keen to Abuse, Terraria and Starbound
in a side-scroller before taking in mouse aim
But yes, it doesn't fit a keen game, Like regenerating HP doesn't fit Doom (outside of red screen tint from a Berserk stim)
gerstrong wrote:
Zilem wrote: Image
Netkeen, Alternate

Image
Netkeen, Alternates
The Dress is nice and if Princess Peach can run through levels with a Dress, why not her?
On the other hand pants should be better for running in jumping in generaö. I like the pants a bit better, but only a small bit. What do you prefer?
I like the Dress variants the most, But with a selection screen we could also have character skin variants.
but we properly should get a set of 4 first ^.^
The Difference Between a Mod and Fan art?, a Fan art is a Concept and a Mod is that Concept put into life.

User avatar
Nisaba
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 822
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 23:34
Location: The Outpost
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by Nisaba » Mon Jan 08, 2018 22:04

Zilem wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 18:05
The question about Lindsey is really; Should she wear her Dress as in Keen 4 or Pants like in Netkeen?
Image
my vote: Dress!
"We have come to conquer you all and bring you lots of candy!" | about me | my current project: play Keen mods on a GameBoy |

gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Wed Jan 10, 2018 12:54

Cool! I have tidied up a bit the code unifying the menus a bit so player selection will be easier on both keen game types.

I am testing right now your sprites and will get back to when I have news regarding MoMGalaxy revision with CG and Python.

How about playing MoMGalaxy in Multiplayer mode, with selection and some rotated shot sprites? Let me try to get there...
Having fun developing stuff...

User avatar
Zilem
Vortininja
Posts: 178
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 2:50
Location: Europe; Denmark
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by Zilem » Wed Jan 10, 2018 19:30

gerstrong wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2018 12:54
Cool! I have tidied up a bit the code unifying the menus a bit so player selection will be easier on both keen game types.

I am testing right now your sprites and will get back to when I have news regarding MoMGalaxy revision with CG and Python.

How about playing MoMGalaxy in Multiplayer mode, with selection and some rotated shot sprites? Let me try to get there...
For Galaxy we should also consider the unique frames in Keen 5 & 6, not used in Keen 4
Keen 5: Shoot up on Rod R/L, platform balancing pose, alternate Knock out (although this one isn't important)
Keen 6: knocked down* and world sprite: rappelling, hanging on satellite
(* Bloodguard, ground slam, knocks Keen down to the ground for a sec, same when hit by a Flect reflected stunner shot)
Keen 2-3 also have some frames that isn't used in keen 1, but i will focus on Keen Galaxy sprite Sheets for now

Once co-op characters working with the original 6 or 7 Games, then we can look into co-op characters for the mods
Many Galaxy don't change the frame set, but the the protagonist may
some have a couple of new Frames for Keen:
Keen 7,8 Atroxian Realm and Zoltan's Revenge

There are those that changes the look of the weapon keen uses like:
Marooned on Mars and The Earth Explodes (W.I.P.)
> i actually have a set of unfinished photoshop layers for the weapons for Invasions of the Vorticons for Galaxy.
I think a Character that don't have, the alt weapon frames needed, should probably should use it's default frames instead.
(There also is Valentine Bash, but that is a slingshot system, with a drop arc for the slingshot projectile)

Image

Image Image
The Difference Between a Mod and Fan art?, a Fan art is a Concept and a Mod is that Concept put into life.

gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Thu Jan 11, 2018 15:50

Alright,

it was a bit more work than expected, but we have itself rotating sprites (only tilted to 90 degree, but that will suffice for now).

Here is a small preview of what is to be expected in Commander Genius version 2.1:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhyKZg_E5Bk

This time no Keen exe is required for this game to be played. It uses another small python script and the engine provides everything else.

I have also integrated the ray sprites and they are displayed tilted when Keen shoots up and down. What do you think?

Reminder: You will see a lot of bugs in this video, but for not relying on data of any Keen exe I think it already does a good job. When that version is ready, this game will be more than playable and provide some new cool stuff. Especially regarding Multiplayer I think this will be very cool!
Having fun developing stuff...

gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:46

Regarding this video I tried to put Kylie in as second player, but remembered that these sprites are only meant to be used in Episode 4. The indices are different in Keen 5, so those of Keen 4 did not work. Are there special sprites packages for Keen 5?
Having fun developing stuff...

User avatar
Zilem
Vortininja
Posts: 178
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 2:50
Location: Europe; Denmark
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by Zilem » Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:20

gerstrong wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 15:50
It was a bit more work than expected, but we have itself rotating sprites (only tilted to 90 degree, but that will suffice for now).

Here is a small preview of what is to be expected in Commander Genius version 2.1:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhyKZg_E5Bk

This time no Keen5.exe is required for this game to be played. It uses another small python script and the engine provides everything else.

I have also integrated the ray sprites and they are displayed tilted when Keen shoots up and down. What do you think?

Reminder: You will see a lot of bugs in this video, but for not relying on data of any Keen exe I think it already does a good job. When that version is ready, this game will be more than playable and provide some new cool stuff. Especially regarding Multiplayer I think this will be very cool!
Seems like i have to alter my mod packages for Keen, in the near future.
will the keen5.py be available? as i have no idea what needs to be written inside it?

I'm not that great reading written german (i can understand a fair bit of spoken)
so had to put it trough a translator, but sounds like people likes both the idea of Keen5.exe not being required and Co-op ^.^

Yes, there is a couple of Bugs, even the sound noise i mentioned.
although the Butler Robot disguising itself as a Vorticon was rather funny XD
Image
gerstrong wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:46
Regarding this video I tried to put Kylie in as second player, but remembered that these sprites are only meant to be used in Episode 4. The indices are different in Keen 5, so those of Keen 4 did not work. Are there special sprites packages for Keen 5?
Well that Answers my question, about how alt characters would be handled in Keen 2, 3, 5, 6.
I've packed some sprites sets for you (but you already know that)

Princess Lindsey, still need some "Polishing" work then i export for her for Keen 5 and 6
BTW; how will CGenius handle a sprite that is a few sprites that is 1 pixel taller then the original?
(top Crown outline)

and work on the Sprite sheets for the Council Page
Image
The Difference Between a Mod and Fan art?, a Fan art is a Concept and a Mod is that Concept put into life.

gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:53

Zilem wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:20

Seems like i have to alter my mod packages for Keen, in the near future.
will the keen5.py be available? as i have no idea what needs to be written inside it?
Nothing special so far, only some file references. Take a look at the version 2.1 topic I opened. I uploaded an updated Version of Keen 4 Plus your sprites included and MoMGalaxy pythonized.

There is not much about the python code. What will be read from that file is what we can decide here. Every variable, every function can be defined as you wish. Since in CG the interface is very new I'm open to whatever you want.
Zilem wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:20

I'm not that great reading written german (i can understand a fair bit of spoken)
so had to put it trough a translator, but sounds like people likes both the idea of Keen5.exe not being required and Co-op ^.^

Yes, there is a couple of Bugs, even the sound noise i mentioned.
although the Butler Robot disguising itself as a Vorticon was rather funny XD
Image

Well that Answers my question, about how alt characters would be handled in Keen 2, 3, 5, 6.
I've packed some sprites sets for you (but you already know that)
well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpj7pVmd4fA

The preview still has those bugs. I will fix them in my free time, code changes in CG considered and also Python code update wherever it makes sense.
Zilem wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:20

Princess Lindsey, still need some "Polishing" work then i export for her for Keen 5 and 6
BTW; how will CGenius handle a sprite that is a few sprites that is 1 pixel taller then the original?
(top Crown outline)

and work on the Sprite sheets for the Council Page
Image
Different sizes are no problem for CG, it does not care. You should only have the Bounding Box in mind when considering the design of levels. In Keen 5 there is a small spot in one level where taller sprites might not fit in. This obviously depends on which sprite is being processed.
Having fun developing stuff...

gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Sat Jan 13, 2018 13:03

For discussion of the python future in CG and what to expect in CG Version 2.1, we can discuss here as well:

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4232

I will be on vacation for one week from now on. When I'm back I will continue on that and let's see what new ideas have evolved then.

Main goals are three for me now to code now:
  • Get pythonized version of MoMGalaxy running without any flaws
  • Multiplayer improvements
  • Player Selection screen so other sprites can be used in single player mode as well
Having fun developing stuff...

User avatar
Zilem
Vortininja
Posts: 178
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 2:50
Location: Europe; Denmark
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by Zilem » Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:37

gerstrong wrote: Nothing special so far, only some file references. Take a look at the version 2.1 topic I opened. I uploaded an updated Version of Keen 4 Plus your sprites included and MoMGalaxy pythonized.
Will do.
gerstrong wrote: well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpj7pVmd4fA

The preview still has those bugs. I will fix them in my free time, code changes in CG considered and also Python code update wherever it makes sense.
!the Flag!

Hmmm....
Image
gerstrong wrote: Different sizes are no problem for CG, it does not care. You should only have the Bounding Box in mind when considering the design of levels. In Keen 5 there is a small spot in one level where taller sprites might not fit in. This obviously depends on which sprite is being processed.
was for 1 frame 2 Jump frames, 2 for the look up and unused frame, so i don't think that will an issue

if we had the janitor running around in original hight that would be an issue
unless he will able to crawl like Johnny Dash (Monster Bash) or crouch
gerstrong wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 13:03
I will be on vacation for one week from now on. When I'm back I will continue on that and let's see what new ideas have evolved then.
Have a nice Trip! ^^
The Difference Between a Mod and Fan art?, a Fan art is a Concept and a Mod is that Concept put into life.

User avatar
XrackProject
Vortininja
Posts: 73
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 19:10
Location: Earth
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by XrackProject » Mon Jan 15, 2018 23:00

I believe the Co-op feature could attract the attention of users, over defaulting to dosbox on PC
Maybe also get some of the youtuber's in on the Idea as that will show to their viewers that Keen co-op
Shikadi-Network, XrackProject (Both Germans) and Hairmonster12 ('Merica'n)
This already has my attention! It would be great if this Coop Keen 4 Game would contain my Commander Neon Skin aswell. I would love to play this game in Coop with my own skin! <3
A project for lifetime.

ComissionerDeWitt
Vortininja
Posts: 97
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2017 20:33

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by ComissionerDeWitt » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:10

Man, this'll be super awesome when its done....
Meet Vinny Vorticos! viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4054

gerstrong
Vorticon Elite
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 14:44
Location: Frankfurt - Germany
Contact:

Re: Video by 2 Players

Post by gerstrong » Thu Jan 25, 2018 16:59

XrackProject wrote:
Mon Jan 15, 2018 23:00
I believe the Co-op feature could attract the attention of users, over defaulting to dosbox on PC
Maybe also get some of the youtuber's in on the Idea as that will show to their viewers that Keen co-op
Shikadi-Network, XrackProject (Both Germans) and Hairmonster12 ('Merica'n)
This already has my attention! It would be great if this Coop Keen 4 Game would contain my Commander Neon Skin aswell. I would love to play this game in Coop with my own skin! <3
Hi XRackProject, we can do this. I just need a Sprite Package and we are good to go :-)
Having fun developing stuff...

Post Reply