If you don't know what I'm talking about (though I'm guessing most of you do): Most DOS games were intended to be seen with a 4:3 aspect ratio. As 320x200 isn't 4:3, the PC monitors of the day would stretch it to fit. DOS games usually had their graphics designed around this stretching, including Keen (compare the title screen of Keen 5 to the box art). Emulators usually have an option to use the proper aspect ratio, though it can look pretty bad if the scaling is too blocky.
Personally, I almost always use aspect ratio correction nowadays. When designing graphics for DOS stuff, I periodically check to make sure it looks correct with aspect ratio correction.
Aspect ratio correction
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Multimania
- Vortininja
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Re: Aspect ratio correction
Short answer: yes, almost all the time.
I still play Keen quite often on an old DOS machine, and most monitors will automatically detect a 4:3 signal and pillarbox if required. However, there are a few cases where it gets stretched. Or, if I'm using an old version of DOSBox, or something which is very low resolution, I might disable aspect ratio correction to get better-looking square pixels with integer scaling.
(And of course, Omnispeak does aspect-ratio correction by default, and the aspect ratio is actually slightly different when the overscan border is taken into account. But I play around with all the different options to make sure they still work.)
I still play Keen quite often on an old DOS machine, and most monitors will automatically detect a 4:3 signal and pillarbox if required. However, there are a few cases where it gets stretched. Or, if I'm using an old version of DOSBox, or something which is very low resolution, I might disable aspect ratio correction to get better-looking square pixels with integer scaling.
(And of course, Omnispeak does aspect-ratio correction by default, and the aspect ratio is actually slightly different when the overscan border is taken into account. But I play around with all the different options to make sure they still work.)
Re: Aspect ratio correction
I don't... I think when I started playing Keen, I had a 486 DOS computer with an SVGA monitor, but somehow I don't remember it being vertically stretched. Could be that my memory's playing tricks on me.
Later, I played them on Windows 95, then 2000, then through DOSBox.
I guess it would also look odd to me to have the tiles (e.g. in Vorticons) not be square?
The Keen 5 box actually always looked vertically stretched to me! I couldn't understand why...
Also, look at the Bounders, Slicestars, Spherefuls... All of them look wrong if stretched to the 4:3 aspect ratio.
Later, I played them on Windows 95, then 2000, then through DOSBox.
I guess it would also look odd to me to have the tiles (e.g. in Vorticons) not be square?
The Keen 5 box actually always looked vertically stretched to me! I couldn't understand why...
Also, look at the Bounders, Slicestars, Spherefuls... All of them look wrong if stretched to the 4:3 aspect ratio.
Member since at least 1998 with... ah... some long absences. I was even a moderator at one point. I'll probably keep coming back here and there as long as this place still exists.
Re: Aspect ratio correction
There was a good video I saw earlier that talked about aspect ratio in DOS games: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvckyWxHAIw (I actually considered making a thread about it, but you beat me to it, Pandakeen!
For the poll, I voted no. A while ago, I played Keen 4 once on DOSBox with its aspect ratio correction turned on, and it was kinda fun; a bit of a new way of looking at a familiar game to me. Just recently, however, I put up Keen 1 on DOSBox with said option on, and it looked a bit weird. That's probably because I'm so used to seeing the pixels be fully square, though; that's how I've seen them for so many years. It might also be the way the scaling is done. I looked at some of my family's old photos of Keen being played on a CRT monitor with Windows XP. It looked a little stretched (the slight angle might skew that perception, though), but not as much as the DOSBox emulation. Could also be that CRTs smooth out the graphics a bit, while DOSBox on a modern screen gives a pretty blocky look. I know I generally prefer to disable CRT filters in games and emulators, but like to play games on real CRT monitors, so my view on aspect ratio correction is perhaps the same. Last year or two, I did play Keen on a CRT (which unfortunately died), but I don't remember any stretching. It did have many video options, though, including horizontal and vertical stretching.
For the poll, I voted no. A while ago, I played Keen 4 once on DOSBox with its aspect ratio correction turned on, and it was kinda fun; a bit of a new way of looking at a familiar game to me. Just recently, however, I put up Keen 1 on DOSBox with said option on, and it looked a bit weird. That's probably because I'm so used to seeing the pixels be fully square, though; that's how I've seen them for so many years. It might also be the way the scaling is done. I looked at some of my family's old photos of Keen being played on a CRT monitor with Windows XP. It looked a little stretched (the slight angle might skew that perception, though), but not as much as the DOSBox emulation. Could also be that CRTs smooth out the graphics a bit, while DOSBox on a modern screen gives a pretty blocky look. I know I generally prefer to disable CRT filters in games and emulators, but like to play games on real CRT monitors, so my view on aspect ratio correction is perhaps the same. Last year or two, I did play Keen on a CRT (which unfortunately died), but I don't remember any stretching. It did have many video options, though, including horizontal and vertical stretching.
Quillax Ship - Where you can download all of my cool, keen mods and super-marvelous fangames!
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entropicdecay
- Mad Mushroom
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Re: Aspect ratio correction
Honestly I'm not sure whether I've had aspect ratio correction in DOSBox or not, particularly because I've used a few different DOSBox forks over time. (currently using DOSBox-X)
Edit: Looking at it, I think I don't have aspect ratio correction on.
Edit: Looking at it, I think I don't have aspect ratio correction on.
Re: Aspect ratio correction
Does DOSBox-X even have aspect ratio correction? When I was testing out aspect ratio correction, I was gonna try it with DOSBox-X, but I didn't see such an option in the menus. I even typed "aspect=true" when the emulator is in DOS, but it gives me an error (yet it works in regular DOSBox).
By the way, I looked at Vyothric's website (cool guy who uploads pictures of games he's beaten on REAL hardware), and in his gaming history article, he has a picture of the Keen 5 title screen in an old monitor. I'll put it up here along with the title screen image from KeenWiki:
Yeah, the stretching is pretty apparent in that monitor!
By the way, I looked at Vyothric's website (cool guy who uploads pictures of games he's beaten on REAL hardware), and in his gaming history article, he has a picture of the Keen 5 title screen in an old monitor. I'll put it up here along with the title screen image from KeenWiki:
Yeah, the stretching is pretty apparent in that monitor!
Quillax Ship - Where you can download all of my cool, keen mods and super-marvelous fangames!
Re: Aspect ratio correction
He should try it on the Amstrad sitting to its left!!
I remember the tall pixels and tiles on my old PC. It seemed to come naturally at the time, though I've become used to the widescreen appearance since!
I remember the tall pixels and tiles on my old PC. It seemed to come naturally at the time, though I've become used to the widescreen appearance since!
Re: Aspect ratio correction
I'm a bit surprised that Yes or Sometimes got way more votes than No, while more people in this thread say they don't use it. 
Keen's graphics are definitely less consistent than some other DOS games with this matter (even when compared to id's later games, Wolfenstein 3D and Doom, which are pretty definitively made with a 4:3 aspect in mind for all graphics), but I still side with aspect ratio correction for Keen, because I feel like it looks better overall (and also I find 4:3 more asethetically pleasing than widescreen, even on a widescreen monitor).
Supposedly there's other issues with DOS games and LCD monitors, like refresh rates. It's not as noticable for me as squashed pixels are, so I don't really care too much.
I saw that video a few times before. It brings up a good point in regards to circles sometimes seemingly not taking a 4:3 stretch into account: They probably thought it looked good enough as an ellipse, and didn't feel like it mattered enough to fix it.Quillax wrote: ↑Sat Aug 05, 2023 5:33 There was a good video I saw earlier that talked about aspect ratio in DOS games: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvckyWxHAIw (I actually considered making a thread about it, but you beat me to it, Pandakeen!
Keen's graphics are definitely less consistent than some other DOS games with this matter (even when compared to id's later games, Wolfenstein 3D and Doom, which are pretty definitively made with a 4:3 aspect in mind for all graphics), but I still side with aspect ratio correction for Keen, because I feel like it looks better overall (and also I find 4:3 more asethetically pleasing than widescreen, even on a widescreen monitor).
Supposedly there's other issues with DOS games and LCD monitors, like refresh rates. It's not as noticable for me as squashed pixels are, so I don't really care too much.