Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

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Vote for your 3 least favorite levels.

1.) Ion Ventilation System
0
No votes
2.) Security Center
1
3%
3.) Defense Tunnel Vlook
1
3%
4.) Energy Flow Systems
1
3%
5.) Defense Tunnel Burrh
2
6%
6.) Regulation Control Center
1
3%
7.) Defense Tunnel Sorra
7
20%
8.) Neutrino Burst Injector
7
20%
9.) Defense Tunnel Teln
5
14%
10.) Brownian Motion Inducer
2
6%
11.) Gravitational Damping Hub
3
9%
12.) Quantum Explosion Dynamo
1
3%
13.) Korath III Base
4
11%
 
Total votes: 35

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proYorp
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Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by proYorp »

Which levels do you avoid until necessary? Why? Which ones seem to become more tedious than fun?

Level reference: https://keenwiki.shikadi.net/wiki/Keen_5_Levels

Unlike the other polls, all of the Keen 5 levels actually fit inside the forum poll size limit, so vote for what you will! I can't think of any levels that have the notoriety to completely take over the poll here either, anyway.



The previous polls in the level rankings series are here:
Keen 4 Least Favorite Level?
Keen 4 Most Favorite Level?
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Ceilick
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by Ceilick »

Neutrino Burst Injector because I dislike the entire upper portion of it. The level design there resembles Keen 6 far more than anything found in keen 5 and it just doesn't feel right imo. This level doesn't do anything interesting with the Shockshunds, and I think could have done better with the Shikadi.

Defense Tunnel Teln just seems boring. The only part of the level that really stands out to me is the blue gem area with the bouncing Slicestar. Even the Robo Red rooms seem dull in comparison to other levels.

Defense Tunnel Sorra is even more boring. The Robo Red arena is decent, but that's really all this level has going for it.

Other levels that were in the running for least favorite include Defense Tunnel Vlook, Brownian Motion Inducer, and the Korath III base.
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Nospike
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by Nospike »

There's only 1 level in Keen 5 which I specifically dislike, and that's Neutrino Burst Injector. Not just the upper portion of it, but also the lower portion. :bloody It has some very frustrating enemy placements and a lack of flow so to speak, which tends to result in many unexpected deaths.
The level design in NBI feels like it's intended for slow and careful exploration, like some kind of cavern level in a different game. But the aesthetic and design in Keen 5 doesn't really suit this style of gameplay for me and this is the only level that's like this.

Some (but not all) of the defense tunnels (can't remember each of them by name, but I suspect it's mainly Sorra or Burrh) as well as Security Center feel kinda meh, but not enough for me to give them a vote.

I also want to mention that I think it's a shame Keen 5 has fewer levels than the other games. It feels like they could've done even more interesting stuff in this game. As it stands, even accounting for the fact that every level except for Korath III is required, Keen 5 feels kinda short.
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by StupidBunny »

Yaaaaay finally

My least favorite level is, and always has been, the Neutrino Burst Injector. A lot of that is that I’ve never liked the bouncy slicestars and suck at dodging them, but the whole rest of the level is just…off somehow. The floret/leafy background doesn’t really mesh with everything else well, and the large open space feels wasteful. Keen 5 is remarkably thrifty with its space, so having this big weird cavernous space with random platforms feels haphazard. It’s also a bastard level on Hard, so many shelleys and shockshunds in places where they can punk you before you have time to respond.

My other lifelong least favorite is Defense Tunnel Sorra (I don’t like the Omegamatic’s East wing I guess.) I’m actually quite fond of the other three defense tunnels, all of which somehow manage to have some sense of place in spite of their apparent simplicity, but Sorra always felt like a slog and not much else, just a long narrow gray tunnel with some stuff to jump over. Oh and more bouncy slicestars.

My third choice was a far less easy one, and I hate to make it because it’s also arguably one of my most favorite levels in Keen 5, but I have to go with my gut and say the Korath III Base. I love the concept behind it: it’s maybe my favorite secret level in Keen. It’s really cool in theory to be able to land on this mysterious yellow planet with its wispy purple clouds and goofy little Scotsmen. I love the porthole windows. I love the little Easter eggs to the level around the game. I love the look of the level on the map and I’ll never forget the time I caught my first tantalizing glimpse of it all after the game bugged out on me, making me forever believe that I was one random moment away, in any Keen game, from being in a new and strange place that, almost dreamlike, would blip away before I could uncover its mystery.

So why am I ranking it here?

Well, once I get over the nostalgia, the mystery and the conceptual brilliance of it, what I find is that there’s a lot very wrong with this level. Mostly it’s the fact that it basically involves going up, up, up a very tall, extremely narrow tower—twice—which lends itself both to a lot of annoying jump timing and a lot of up-and-down backtracking, and also means it’s highly linear with no real complexity, no switches or bridges or doors or puzzles of any kind. Also, the Koraths are great, but the level otherwise has very little in the way of enemy variety, making it feel rather deserted. I would’ve loved to see the Koraths surrounded by the robots and aliens of the Shikadi interlopers, which also would’ve given the Koraths a chance to interact a bit more than they do here. Another thing is…well I get that there’s only so much room in a tile set or a development schedule but it would’ve been cool I guess to have a little bit more of Korath III itself visible. Even at ground level, it still feels like you’re miles above the planet’s surface.

The other problem though is that the secret exit—which is yet another genius, amazing thing about this level—requires you to beat exactly none of the actual level, since it’s not behind a door or anything. And since I know it’s there, it just saps my motivation to beat the rest of the level in the first place. What’s the point of getting that key and card, if I’m just gonna bin them on my way out the door anyway? I feel like putting the fuse behind a keyed door would’ve been a decent compromise.
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XkyRauh
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by XkyRauh »

SECURITY CENTER.

Ugh. It's the second level in the game, but it drives me nuts. I don't like the design of the first area, where there are two there-and-backs you have to do, and the second area is a long there-and-back. The upper half of the level is great because it's much more linear, but I feel like half the gameplay in this level is running back and forth in the bottom half of the map... which wouldn't be so bad on its own if not for the music. I don't know why I hate the music in Security Center so much, but I find it almost as annoying as Too Hot from Keen4! Just getting to the blue keygem, you hear the music loop at least once, and by the time you get to the Security Card, you're up to 4 or 5 iterations. By the time you finish, you've heard the tune at least 7 times--and that's if you're speedrunning and know what you're doing! >:

This level is such a momentum-killer for me. After the cute and light music in the first level, this one feels like a gatekeeper from the rest of the fun in the episode. :dead2

As for the Korath III level, I made lyrics for it back in 2018:
Korath III, the hidden base, the secret level song.
Journey from the bottom to the top.
The level's really short if you hit the hidden fuse, but
if you play on Easy then it's not.
The level's tall, you fall and fall, you finally hit the ground.
The keycard on the left is just half-way.
Then you fall back to the bottom, climb up on the right, and
die a million times along the way.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... enBase.mp3
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Soul Monster
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by Soul Monster »

This was a difficult one for me, because not only is this my favorite game of the series, but there's fewer levels to choose from than 4, which has 18 while this has 13. I almost wasn't going to select 3 stages, because I honestly feel that there are no stages in 5 that are outright bad, even if some parts of a stage may be annoying or boring. After much deliberation, here's what I came up with:

Neutrino Burst Injector: I'm not surprised that this one is getting the most votes on this poll. I agree with Ceilick in that there's some parts of this stage that more closely resemble the style of level design found in Keen 6, particularly on the top half with the angled platforms. And, like a lot of people are pointing out, some of the places the Shockshunds are placed can lead to potentially unfair challenge and end up killing you before you have time to react or see them, especially on the angled floors I just mentioned. I should also mention the bouncing Slicestars. While I generally don't have much trouble getting past them, they can result in some unfair challenge when you're not in the one safe spot under the platform on the floor the Shikadi is at. Besides these criticisms, I just find the stage bland and uninteresting.'

Gravitational Damping Hub: I actually really like this stage, but there's a couple things about it that really annoy me. First, I hate that part where you have to ride the platforms across a floor of cannons and fire helixes. I don't like saving in-level, but this is one of those places where I simply have no choice, because I've died so many trying to get across and back. It doesn't help that the cannons can fire so erratically and moving away from the screen and coming back completely alters the pattern. Second, the part of the stage where you obtain the green gem is another frustration of mine. Again, I hate saving in-level, and I'm a completionist, so I always try to get everything in the stage, but that Sphereful has trapped me so many times in that little pocket in the bottom left of the stage, forcing me to start the entire stage over. Despite these criticisms, I think it's a really good stage, and I also enjoy the music playing during it.

Korath III Base: I expected a lot of people to say this was one of their least favorites. Again, I really like this stage, and I think it adds some nice variety to the game in that it's the only stage that doesn't take place on the Omegamatic, instead set on Korath III and providing a chance to explore the planet. However, that massive drop is a pain. Stupidbunny pretty much summed up what's wrong with this stage, having to drop down, climb one building, fall back down, climb the other, and then go to the exit, when you could just easily just take the secret exit out to bypass all of that. Again, I'm a completionist, so I'm going through the whole stage, but I don't mind all that and despite the design, I still enjoy this stage.

@Nospike I agree, Keen 5 does feel very short, in fact, these days, I can get through the whole game in just 2 hours. I don't think it's just that there are fewer levels, but also that a lot of these stages are much shorter and more straight forward, so there's less room for exploration.
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by Hisymak »

To be honest, I can't really say I have any favourite or least favourite level in Keen 5.
For me, all of the Keen5 levels always visually looked very similar to each other (Keen5 uses just three visual sets - black/yellow stripe, red and green walls). The gameplay feels the same for whole Keen5, except Korath3 base, and probably the first and last levels being the most memorable to me. For the whole rest of Keen5, especially the tunnel levels, I have problems remembering how a specific level looks like and on which side of the central part it is located. Remembering level names? No chance.
I simply did not build any specific like/dislike relation to any specific level, however, maybe I was always amazed by levels having those long-path-following platforms, which was a great new feature after Keen4. Overally, playing through Keen5 always felt fun, I like this game and when I'm tempted to play some Keen, I tend to choose for Keen5 most likely.
For me, the biggest flaw of Keen5 is low number of levels compared to other Keen games, so the game feels really short (for a paid game) and lack of optional levels except the secret level. I would appreciate more content and more variety.
This problem was pretty well addressed in the best Keen5 level pack mods: The Alphamatic and The Armageddon App. These mods really added more length and the desired variety, while taking advantage of the Keen5 gameplay style, features and creature set. So the Keen5 level pack mods were the mods I enjoyed the best.
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by Multimania »

This one's hard — Keen 5's levels are pretty consistently good, and at worst are either a bit boring, or a bit annoying. In fact, I think there's at least something interesting in all of the levels.

I picked Defense Tunnel Burrh, Regulation Control Centre, and Defense Tunnel Sorra. Partly because everyone's already talked a lot about Neutrino Burst Injector, and I don't have much to add. I definitely could pick a slightly different list on a different day, though.

Defense Tunnel Burrh:

This level is structured around the idea of there being three "layers", with lots of backtracking from one to another. And it's the backtracking that's a bit annoying to me, particularly at the very start (though the pole there always felt kind-of dangerous and interesting), and the very end (what's the point of having all the keys and doors next to each other?).

Regulation Control Centre:

The bottom half of this level is great, the top half is a bit "meh". Maybe it's the mines, which I was always a bit too wary of, or the poles and slicestars at the start (which slow the pace of the level down a bit), but it never quite did it for me. And I'm deeply conflicted about the "secret" upper route over the robo-red area: I can't decide whether it's a brilliant shortcut, or just skips most of the interesting parts of the level.

Also, possibly because the Security Centre and Gravitational Damping Hub both used them, the green tileset never seemed as impressive as the red one.

Defense Tunnel Sorra:

What's there to say? It's another Defense Tunnel, and there's not a lot going on. It's very flat compared to the others: you basically just complete it in a straight line, and the robo-red area is flat and boring. The big secret at the start is neat enough, and there's some good opportunities for facing off against Volte-Faces, but really, this is the most boring level in the game.
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by The Shifted One »

Multimania wrote: Sat Dec 18, 2021 1:44 This one's hard — Keen 5's levels are pretty consistently good, and at worst are either a bit boring, or a bit annoying. In fact, I think there's at least something interesting in all of the levels.
I completely agree with this.
I also really like how all the tunnels represent actual tunnels and offer a change to the gameplay.
I always appreciated small details like Keen entering the level on the right side of the screen too.
That said, if I had to pick 2 of these were still my least favorites.

1: Defense Tunnel Vlook
Still not bad, minor backtracking early on wasn't too great and the optional part near the end felt a little dull.
A decent chunk of waiting on Slicestars and Spindreds too which has never been my favorite thing.

2: Brownian Motion Inducer
Because of all the doors the level just doesn't feel like a complete whole.
Doors can work fine if they feel like the actually lead to a separate room or their destination feels more natural; as in, a completely different part of the level.
This is something Keen games usually handle really well but here it feels a bit on the weak side although it still isn't a terrible example either.

3: Defense tunnel Teln
That blue keygem was never fun to get.
The optional extra ammo was also way more hassle than it was ever going to be worth.
I also personally feel there's 1 Robored too many as they are both used in the same fashion.

All of these are honestly very nitpicky.
There really aren't any obvious flaws in any level, but this is it if I had to pick.
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Re: Keen 5 Least Favorite Level?

Post by Quillax »

This was actually a bit difficult for me, because I think all of the levels are very good. My selections, therefore, are just based on a few nitpicks and not any fatal flaws.

Defense Tunnel Sorra: The secret at the beginning is cool and so is the Robo Red arena. The Slicestars and Volte-Faces have a few interesting uses here. Other than that, though, there isn't a whole lot to the level I suppose. Also, one secret area is a pain to get out of because of a nearby fire helix and there's another at the very end that is impossible to get out of! Like, did Tom Hall and his crew even test that part? Good thing I know about cheats when I got trapped in there.

Gravitational Damping Hub: This is a good level. However, getting all those points in the center with all the laser cannons and moving platforms costed me so many deaths! Also, when you turn off the bridge to get the gem below you, there's a risk of landing on the Sphereful below, although for me that's pretty rare. I like the Spirogrip, but it just seems to kinda get in the way rather than provide any interesting challenges.

Quantum Explosion Dynamo: This is a great conclusion for the game. On one hand, I feel as if the the machine could've been more well-guarded, but on the other hand, the emptiness does give the sense that it's a place that only a select few are allowed to access. It's not like every game needs to have an "Oh so epic!" finale anyway. I kinda wish the Shikadi Masters were more of a threat, though. They didn't really do much last time I played this level. Also, it's a torture to get the points just below the fire helixes at the bottom-left corner because you can only jump so low, which requires an extremely light press of the jump key. Plus, it doesn't seem to be possible to get all of the ring of Vitalin in the center with all those laser cannons.
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